Unbankable with Alex Shvarts

Welcome to Unbankable, the podcast for entrepreneurs who don't take no for an answer. I'm Alex Schwarz, and today we're talking about something that fascinates me. How elite athletes transition from the peak of professional sports to building successful businesses. Because here's the reality. Being great at one thing doesn't automatically make you great at another. But the mindset that creates champions can absolutely create entrepreneurs. Let's dive in. Today I'm joined by Mario Chamers, two-time NBA champion with the Miami Heat, one of the most clutch players in basketball history. But Mario's story doesn't end with basketball. Since leaving the NBA, he's continued playing professionally in leagues like the big three and internationally while building his personal brand and exploring business opportunities. What makes Mario different? He's not just another retired athlete trying to sell it relevant. He's someone who understand what it takes to perform under pressure and win when it matters the most. And here's why this matters to our unbankable audience. The same mentality that helped Mario hit game-winning shots and win championships is exactly what entrepreneurs need to succeed when everyone else says no. Mario's here to share how athletes can transition from competitive edge into business success. Mario, thank you. Thank you for joining me. I know you just got off a flight from another state, from another show, and and it's and it's a big thing. Like, you know, you looked at my wall, right? I I'll never be like you. I'll never be like any any of the musicians that you know, but it inspires me and it helps me and I know it's going to help the people that are are watching this and listening this to get to the next level to get better to believe in themselves cuz at some point we all didn't. Right. So, thank you for joining me for appreciate it, man. It's a big deal. Mario, you won two NBA championships with Miami Heat, but you're still playing professionally in big three and other league. What drives you to keep competing and how has that mindset translated into business thinking? Um, the biggest thing that drives me to keep playing is my kids. Um, I got four kids, three boys and a girl. Uh, my oldest is a senior in high school, graduates next month. And then my daughter's a 16-year-old and my youngest is a seven-year-old. So, they're all getting into sports and I just want to show them like, you know, even when you if you don't make it professional, there's still or the NBA, I should say, there's still other avenues of basketball that you can still get into. And um you know, for us, we're a basketball family. So, it's kind of like if it's in your DNA, why go away from it? Like, there's so many avenues that you could do if you don't want to if you don't make it and actually playing. So, I just try to show them different ways of, you know, having fun with the game. And um a old man like me can still go. Old man like you, man. Is that safe for me, man? Hey, listen. I turned 40 in May, so everybody's telling me 40. That's old, man. I'm getting old, man. I'm getting there. I'm getting there. How old do you think I'm going to turn this year? Um, 42. Thank you. I really appreciate that. Nobody's that kind to me anymore. All right, let's get specific about the transition. A lot of athletes struggle when they're, you know, player and careers end. How are you approaching the business world differently than you approached basketball? Um, like you said, I definitely struggled trying to get into the business world at first just because I didn't know anything. Um, you know, for us playing basketball, we kind of focus on just the playing aspect and what it does and what we need to do for every day to be successful on the court and not really think about off the court. So, for me, that was kind of my focus. And then when I tore my Achilles, I got hurt. Um, that's when everything kind of opened up for me like, wow, like I can't play basketball right now. So, what am I going to do? And um you know I'm blessed to have a great team around me starting with uh you know my financial adviser who was my college teammate at Kansas um one of the biggest people in Kansas City um one of my best friends that I've known since 2 years old. He handles my stocks and stuff like that. So for me it was more about putting people that I trust in positions that can teach me instead of going out and trying to figure out everything on my own. So that's a big thing for me is like I like to ask questions and like you said everybody's professional on something and for me I wasn't a professional anything except basketball. So I got a lot of questions for like anything that happens with business wise. See I tell this and so at Funkite we've we've had over 350,000 businesses apply for business funding right cuz banks say no like it's all about your credit. all about, you know, less risk for them and we take more risk cuz we work with entrepreneurs and businesses that don't have that type of history. But the most important thing you say and what I keep telling um entrepreneurs is you are good at something, but you can't be great at everything, right? And what you said really resonates because you said, "I got a team. I got a team." So somebody could be a fantastic chef, man. They know how to cook. They know how to serve a meal, but that doesn't mean they know how to, you know, run payroll, do HR, go out and get a team because you've got to be able to get, you got to get good people. I know you trust your people cuz the way you speak about them, you know, it's good. So, I tell that to business owners. Look, you you're good at something. Now, get the help you need to keep building so you keep growing at what you're good at. And so, it's important. Did you always have the right team from day one? Um, no. Because I didn't have a team at first and that was like my biggest mistake that I did during my playing days is I didn't attack the market, the outside off the court market like I really could. And for me, it was a little bit different having Braun and D. Wade and Chris Bos and Ray Allen. So, it's like whatever market I am going to be into, it's going to be very, very little compared to what they're into. But, the little add-ups matter. And that's what I that's how I kind of live today. It's like little small pots always add up to a big pot. They do. All right. you know, so you just mentioned, you know, LeBron, Wade, and and so you've played with players like that in Basher and the Heats Championship runs. What did you learn about leadership and teamwork at that level that applies to building a business today? I learned a lot from them guys. It's uh the main thing I learned from, you know, Dway when it come to like business and just being a person is being selfless. Um never making the moment about yourself. always, you know, making sure your team feels appreciated, feel like they're along with the ride with you. Um, Braun definitely the way he carried himself, um, like a professional at all times, always on the up and up, always business-like. And then from Chris Bos, he's a little different. He's the quiet one, so his movements are very quiet. So, if you're not with him, you're not really going to know what he's doing. But, he's he's a type of person where like he's always trying to learn something. And that's one thing I've always respected about him. It's like even when we be on the road, he'll be in the room watching the Spanish channel and just learning his Spanish and refreshing different things. So just being around him is always always the willingness to learn something. And that's like like you said, applying it to today's today's business aspect. It's like for me, I'm new to the business, but I ask a lot of questions cuz I want to learn. I don't want to just be a person where you could tell me something. I'll be like, "Okay, go do that." No. I want to know why you doing that, how you doing it, what's the benefits of it, what's the what's the pros and cons of everything that's going into what we're about to do. So, I'm asking all the hard questions when it comes to my money, I should say, my money and my business. You know, I'm I'm sitting here right I I never go to motivational speakers. Like, to me, that's [ __ ] right? I'd rather be with people like you cuz I could learn a lot. And you know what? Like the the most amazing thing I'm seeing is there's a real successful guy who's accomplished so much of what he knows how to do, right? And how humble how you speak, how you act, right? There's no show, there's no fuss, like really down to earth. And that's a lot of that that's something that a lot of entrepreneurs they they get caught up in a little bit of success and they don't understand that true and long-term success is keeping the balance it can be taken away from you any minute right you know and um and and that's the first lesson here from Mario is like money likes quiet I don't know if you know that right I live by that money likes quiet it's great to enjoy your success like you should be happy that you're you're s but that was yesterday. Yeah. You don't know what's coming tomorrow. Sure don't. Right. So that's good. I'm I'm enjoying like it's it's a good vibe, man. So you're known for hitting clutch shots, especially that famous three-pointer in the NCAA championship. How do you handle pressure in business decisions? Is it the same way you handled the pressure on the court? No, totally different. Um, on the court I have all the confidence in the world for any shot just because I've spent over 25 years doing this, over 30 years doing this. Business world, I have no confidence at all. So, it's like for me, you approach me with anything, my first thing is to call call one of my best friends who's kind of like my manager, call my dad or call my financial advisor, just be like, "What does this sound like to you? Does it sound good? Does it sound like something we should be interested in? So we just skip over it all together just cuz for me I get a lot of like different things people pull at me just cuz like I'm who you are champion winning on every level and plus they think they can get over definitely that's another thing and that's probably the first thing on your radar is like okay like why are they approaching me are they trying to use me right agree yeah so when they when people approach me with business I always ask like what are you looking for like what what are you getting out of this it's not about what I'm getting out of it what are you getting out of it and what's going to do for you because you're not approaching me for about me. Like it's not about me, it's your business. Yeah. And that's that's just about being business. It's your business, your baby. So, you definitely want to be selfish with it. But at the same time, you got to share your vision of your dream. Not saying that somebody would take your dream, but just share what you're kind of doing if you want to bring somebody into it. So, for me, it's just like just ask the questions like, and if it sounds good, we'll look more into it. But if not, we just we'll pass early and not even waste the time. That's good. How often do you say no?

Now, let me ask a different question. How do you feel about saying no? I love saying no. Good. It's it's one of my coming from where I come from and being in the NBA, like having my family around where you always got to say yes, you always got to do this. You always got to help. And now in the business world, it's like h nope, not interested. And it's important when you reach a certain I'm not going to say status, but when you reach a certain point in life to be able to protect what you've built, right? Cuz it's about protecting cuz nobody's going to protect you. You know, that's the biggest thing. You got to protect it because for us, them NBA checks don't come no more. Like that million dollar checks, it's over. It's over. I won't see those again until who knows. So, it's kind of like now, oh, you'll see them again. I'll definitely see it again. I'm looking at you, man, and I I know you're going to see them again. I'll definitely see it again. But you got to take the baby steps to get back to that stage of making, you know, that type of money. I've reviewed and underwrote and analyzed so many different types of businesses, right? Like probably know the ins and outs of like 90% of businesses, how they work, how they make money, what to look for, but you know, sometimes I don't know. Something comes across and I'm like, what is that? And that's what I I try to tell you know the people watching and the entrepreneur and even you know businesses that I talk to. I don't know everything, right? But you know what? I might know somebody who does know who can get those answers. And there's nothing wrong with picking up up the phone and calling and saying, "Hey, how does this business operate?" Like, you know, how do they make money? Where does the money where does the revenue come from? What risks are there? Right. Right. Cuz we don't know everything, you know. So, I'm I'm the first to admit that I I don't know everything. So, we you actually just covered on this. You said, you know, the NBA check. So the NBA gave you financial security, right? And you were smart enough to hold on to it the right way because a lot of players don't, right? But it also gave you a platform. How are you leveraging your basketball brand to create business opportunity? And what's really working today? like you said, just using basketball as far as like big three stuff, uh, the Ice Cube League, more of interviews and like different things with the NBA, telling stories about our 2013, 2012 team with the Heat. So, just being part of that run and part of that team, it opens up a lot of doors in the sports world where people want to know like, how did y'all connect as a team? What was it like behind closed doors? What was that run like? What did it feel? So, it's always an opportunity for me to talk about basketball just because I've been very successful in the game of basketball. So, I just use that to maneuver different things and try to figure it out. If you're getting a value from this conversation and enjoying what you know, people like Mario have to share, please hit subscribe, drop some comments, let me know who you'd like me to bring on or what questions I should ask of successful people like Mario. All right, so let me ask you this. Um, people recognize you when you walk around all the time. Especially all the time. Does that ever get annoying? No, I love it. I tell people ask me that all the time. It's like, if y'all didn't recognize me, what what would I be here for? Like, I'm here for a reason. Okay. But you're very humble about it. You really are humble. You're humble. Yeah. I I mean, I love my fans and without them, I wouldn't I wouldn't be humble. You autograph every single time. Every time. Every time they ask. I should have asked you for more autographs. Uh but let let me tell you something. My first experience getting an autograph and um I was um six or seven years no like 9 10 years old and we lived in New York and a lot of us Jewish people in New York. We went to the Catskill Mountains. There was either the Concord Hotel for the rich people or the Browns Hotel for the rest of us. Right. Right. And you know you ate breakfast, lunch and dinner. all you can eat in this big cafeteria and you know like these pools. I mean like Jerry Lewis and like all these people used to perform there like people you probably never even heard of. I heard of Jerry Lewis. So you you never probably heard of a guy named Hal Lincoln. Uh Hal Lindon he was like in Welcome Back Card or whatever it doesn't matter. So they would have like these celebrities perform at night right? Like so I remember at breakfast like I see Hal Lindon and he used to do this commercial like we'd come home from school and it was this commercial. It's 3:30. Do you know where your kids are? Like, so I see how Lyndon and I came up to him and I came up to him and I said, you know, I was a kid and I said, "Can I have your autograph?" He said, "No, get away. Can't you see our meeting?" Wow. And I never felt that I could ever come up until I was much older and ask for an autograph because, you know, I was like a 10-year-old kid. You could have just autographed right there. You killed it. Like, I was like, "Wow." You know, I walked away. Okay. I mean, I mean, listen, I I got over it, but like it was everything that he shouldn't have been, right? Which leads me to there's a lot of successful people that need to give back. They need to act a certain way. And a lot of them are everything that they're they're they're everything they're not supposed to be. They're everything that they don't like in a person, you know? And and that's that's terrible because we have to look up to role models. We have to look at successful athletes who are successful entrepreneurs and be want to be like them, right? You play chess. Yeah, but I'm not good like you. You're not. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm a y'all. I'm the only one good in the room. He lost. Hey, Mike plays Mike. Mike lost. Okay. Chess every day. I know, but he needs to keep playing. But, you know, I'll tell that to him. I'll train him. I'll make him a good chess player. I miss him. That was a lot of fun. All right, let's talk about business reality. You're competing against other former athletes for opportunities. That happens, right? We say that sometimes. Okay. And everyone has a story. What makes your approach to business different from other players? The biggest thing I kind of stand off is is probably my humbleness and the championship aspect. Um, you know, the saying goes, everybody wants to be part of a winner or wants a winner on their team. And you know, for me, being on a lot of winning teams, winning on every level, I have a lot of insight on what it takes to win and how to win. So, people kind of gravitate to me and that's how that kind of goes. There is something about being a winner and not being a winner. Right. Right. Yeah, you're right. People do gravitate. I was at a conference two months ago and Dan Marino was there, right? and you know he's very nice guy talking and stuff like that you know he's Mr. charm, right? You know what I'm saying? And so I got up to it was big conference and um I was lucky enough to be one of the opening panelists. It's a financial conference. I got chosen. It was a big deal for me. It's like winning. And then Dan Marino speaking and I'm I get up and I asked So I said, "Dan, let me ask you a question." I said, "How did you get up the next day after losing the biggest game of your life and you were able to continue for so long? How'd you do it?" And you know, he gave a a pretty good answer, but um not a lot of people can say, "I won the biggest game of my life," right? And they're chasing that dream. And a lot of entrepreneurs might never win that game. They might never be that winner that they want to be. They want to be. That doesn't mean you quit, though. Doesn't mean you stop. Find different avenues to get to it. Right. You know, and if you didn't win those, you'd still keep going. Oh yeah, definitely. Right. You wouldn't give up. And you still be the same guy, right? But I've met a lot of winners that aren't like you. Oh, me too. And they're like jerks and you know their [ __ ] don't stink and you don't want to be around them. No, you definitely don't. You just walk away. So you you continue, you know, the big three. You done some international stuff. I think you're still doing some international. No, I've done international. You're done with international? Yeah. Who wants to go international anyway? I had a lot of fun in Greece though. I will say you did Greece. Yeah, I did Greece and Italy. So those are the two places. Italy. I love Italy and Italy. Yeah. Great people. Great people. Great food. Great food. Great wine. Yeah. I like Gree wine better than Greek wine. Greek wine better than Really? The white wine? Yeah, the white wine. Yeah, I love that kind of like a little sweeter wine. Yeah. Yeah. Me too. Me too. I like old wine. Yeah. Especially if like they're buying but like you know whatever. But no, you said the magic word. Um, so how do you balance staying an active play active as a player and again you know you're building business interest like you're really thinking long term? You realize you know you've got so much time left in the game, right? So you're building business interest. So is the is basketball right now still like a big priority for you? Like is that driving you still every day to be able to go play somehow and be seen by the people your fans? Um, or is it more of a tool? For me, basketball is more of like an outlet for me. So, right now, it's more of like a routine. So, I get up and I'll go work out just because I've been doing that for so long. It helps me clear my mind and start getting ready for my day. So, I'll go work out. My usually days, I take my son to school at 7:00 a.m. I'll go work out after that. And then after that, it's kind of either go back to sleep for a little bit or I'm just wherever my mind's taking me trying to figure out different things and what avenues I can get into. So for me, uh, yeah, basketball's an outlet and it's easy for me to stay in shape cuz my kids are playing basketball and I'm training them. So it's always always something for me to do, always something going on on the basketball court. So I mean, I've been doing it for this long and it wouldn't feel right to just stop and not touch it again. Good. Good. I told Michael my basketball story three times. I played three times. I wound up in the hospital. I don't touch a basketball. I just sits there, man. Seriously, I'm not made for jumping. I play other games, but you know, besides chess, but not. So, listen. Athletes get pitched a lot. You know, celebrities get pitched, right? And I'm sure you've gotten pitched a lot. So, there's two reasons why people pitch celebrities or athletes. One is, you know, they want their name attached to the brand or they want your money, right? Right. Um, what's the best pitch you ever heard or what makes a good pitch that I'm still trying to figure out because for me, I just been around a lot of fast talkers that the fast talker doesn't move me. It's kind of like I got to see something like show me the pro the proof in the pudding. Okay. And then we can really sit down and talk. Like if you approach me just fast talking fast facts, I'm kind of like uh yeah, anybody could do this, right? So it's like more for me, I got to see it on paper and see actually what you're doing and then I'll feel more comfortable going into the conversation and and seeing what what we could do. That actually answers my next question. What's a bad pitch? And the bad pitch is the same as that pitch you just said. It's because people So I, you know, when I talk to people, I don't pitch. I tell them what I do cuz you know, we have investors at Funkite. I don't pitch them. I say, "Look, this is what I do. This is my approach. This is how I do it, right? And this is what I've done over the years because I believe that people will want to invest in something if they like it. You can't convince somebody to invest, right? you. That never works. They're only going to invest if they like it. They like what you're doing. They see your vision and they believe in you. Right. Right. Cuz a lot of the businesses we give money, it's not always about how much money they make. It's about the passion and, you know, the drive that that owner, business owner has. And you believe in them. They're going to work hard, you know. And then the fact that like I don't like when people rush you. Like I had uh I had somebody approach me about the company. I won't put the company out there, but they approach me and I'll just give a time frame. They approached me on like a Thursday and they sent me the paperwork and they wanted 25,000 by Saturday and I was just like like I don't even have time to read over all this and send it to my team. Like what is the rush right now? And like when they start rushing you rushing you is kind of like yeah I don't want no parts of that cuz you're you're up to something more than just that. Like what's the rush? So I call it a red flag. It's a real red flag. So look, we're in the business of providing money to business owners and we can do it in 4 hours. We literally if we get the paperwork we need and we can review it, we can send you know a million dollars in two in four hours. We've we've done some really fat average it's about 24 hours but this is different because we have businesses that come to us and you know we we review what we need to review right and we make a decision and you know a lot of times we can't do it because it doesn't fit what we're doing but but when private people come and ask for money and you know I got and I need it in that's a problem that's a red flag because nothing I mean listen it's not like somebody's at the doctor and they need an operation And so that's a big red flag, right? And even when businesses apply, so we don't when somebody comes to us and says, "Look, I need money to make payroll." If you're at a point where you need money to make Well, okay, it's one thing because Walmart's taking their time to write you a check for your supplies, but it's another thing you can't make payroll, man. You got to a point where you're running a business and you like you're you're in real trouble. And there's a lot of, you know, I do a lot of talking on podcasts and reals and stuff about what how to manage cash flow, what bills to pay when. That just a whole different subject, but that's a red flag for anyone. And you know, there's successful entrepreneurs here. They get pitched all the time. Somebody needs money in 24 hours and they send you paperwork. That's that's not a good sign. Not for me. Um, very methodical, very you're very um Yeah, you got it together, man. Good for It took a while, but yeah, I got it. Finally got it weren't always like this. No, it wasn't always like this. My dad is more like this. So, it's more me picking up from him and just all these years of watching him do it. Now, it's kind of like, all right, now it's my turn. So, just remembering the stuff that he went through and the stuff that he taught me and just applying it to now. Sounds like your dad was a a big role in your life, huh? He was. I mean, he was a first sergeant in the military. He was out there for 23 years. Also, my basketball coach. So, yeah, very close with my dad. My dad was my dad passed away about seven years ago at 94. So he had a great life. Um but I I will tell you my dad was my best friend and he taught me everything and uh I have something that he wore and I still can't wear it because I don't feel that I've achieved in life. I I can't wear something that he was wear because I I haven't done everything right the way he wanted me to do it. and I'm waiting for that day where I can put it on and say I've lived up to my dad's expectations. That's funny cuz I have a story. So for me growing up, my my dad and my mom both play basketball. My dad wore 32, my mom wore 15, my sister wore my dad's number, and I always wore my mom's number. Okay. And I never told my dad. I was like, I I never wanted to wear 32 just cuz I didn't think I could live up to your footsteps on the basketball court. Like I did tell him that. I never told him. I still to this day. Do we cut this out or No, tell him. Send it to him. I'mma clip it and send it to him cuz he going to be like, "Oh, that's the reason why you never wore it." See, it takes Unbankable to find something like this out. Okay. Yeah, I can't do it. I I I I look at it all the time and it's something that my brother was a jeweler that he made for him. It's a Jewish thing, uh, Jewish high, but I I can't. And my brother's like, "No, you know, dad would have wanted you to have it and wear." And I just like it brings tears to my eyes to even think about it. You know, it's um it's a it's a tough one. Uh, all right. So, here's a tough one. A lot of professional athletes go broke after retirement, right? A lot of entrepreneurs go broke. How do you think about money and investments differently now than when you did when you just started playing your in your career? And you weren't always like this. I I can tell that. Right. I wasn't. Um I'm not going to lie. When I first got to the NBA, I didn't want to do anything except play basketball. Like I was not businessminded at all. Didn't care about business. And I thought Did you spend money left and right? Not left and right. I I spent more money just like on family than anything else. And of course, you know, once you get a little bit money, you're going to buy Yeah, you going to buy a couple things. Yeah, you should. You work You earned it. Never. I never went crazy. And one thing that did save me was uh during my playing time, I had a car deal so I could switch out my car every month. And I never I only bought one car my whole career. Was that um like an endorsement type? It was endorsement deal. So I was Oh, I love that. I was driving all types of cars. The only thing I ever bought was a Range Rover. No, I bought I bought a Cadillac my rookie year and then my third or fourth year I bought a Range Rover and that was the only two things I bought besides my house. And that's cool, man. You get to switch a car every month. Yeah, that was that was the best thing. So I do you really did you like that? Like you can't even get used to switching a car every I loved it though. But was it like different cars or exotic cars? It was all exotic cars like Lamos and like McLaren. Oh wow. Ghost and Rafes and all that. So it was like I was just driving something different every month. Oh, and then I got teammates like Braun and D Way that's already doing that. So, it made me feel like, oh, okay, I made it and I'm not spending money on it. So, yeah, let them buy the car. I'm just I'm just That's cool. Yeah. So, I I had a good endorsement. Yeah. I didn't really have to spend a lot, but um so I did a pretty good job of saving my money and uh being in a good position now. Any failures? A lot of failures. A lot of failures. Um just because uh when I tore my Achilles in 2015, I was just searching for something. Um I didn't have like basketball's always been my outlet. So that was whenever I needed to get something off my mind, I go to the court. And not having that, it was like I need something now. Like I need this, I need that, I need that. I got to figure out how to make money. I got to figure out how to do this instead of just slow rolling it. Like I still got money coming in because I got hurt during the season. So my check doesn't stop, right? It's just I know that there's not another one coming after this. So that's when I was just trying to get into every deal. 5,000 here, 10,000 here, just trying to figure out everything. And then my financial I had got a new financial advisor. He was like, he's like, "Stop." Like, "Whatever you doing, stop, cuz you're going to blow through your money. You're not going to have anything left to live off of." I was like, "Oh, okay. So, what do I do? Like, how do I get into deals? How do I How do I do?" He was like, "Sit down, put a team together, talk to everybody that you want to be involved with and see what they're involved in." And that's when I was like, "Okay." So, just pretty much piggyback off what the other business, my other business friends are already doing. And that's how I can start getting my feet wet in the business world. And then once you do that, you start getting comfortable. Then you can start having those conversations on your own and start bringing them back to the team and seeing what's going on. So, my financial advisor really helped me out a lot and sat me down. and I was like, "Yo, this is the game plan that we're going to go with, and as long as you stick to this, you'll be good." So, it's about game planning and really listening and adhering to what somebody's trying to tell you and not be so big like, "Oh, yeah. I got this. I can do this on my own." Like, "Yeah, I hear your advice, but I still want to do it my way." And I was just like, "Nope. I'm going to do it your way. You're the professional in this. You know the coach." Yeah. You know, you're the player. I'm the player. And that's good. It's always good to keep in mind that like listen, I do coach a lot because I have a team, but I I'll put it like this. You know, when I'm when I'm the CEO of the company, like between 9:00 p.m. and 6:00 in the morning, from 6:00 in the morning until 6:00 p.m. when I'm here with them, I'm an employee, man. I work for them. I work with them, man. Yeah, I try to lead and everything, but I do the same. Anything that I have them do, I can do the same. I do it. I'll make coffee. I'll I'll vacuum the floor. I don't give a [ __ ] I'll talk to a a customer the same way they I get on the phone with them. You know, I remember Dwight always told me this like when I my rookie and he said, "The best leaders always know how to follow." That's right. And that always stuck with me. The best leaders know how to follow. And that always stuck with me. That's good stuff. So, if you had to do it all over again now that you know all this, right? I say this to myself, if I had to do it all over again, would I do anything different? I say to myself, no, because I would have to learn all of this again. I'd have to make the same mistakes, but, you know, I take a little different chances, you know, approach things a different way. I would say yes because I had a lot more money to play with back then. and knowing what I know now, I think I could like 3x, 4x, 5x, 6x times my money instead of like 1x, 2x right now with the with the little, not little, the smaller checks that we, you know, that we receive. So that's the only thing I would do differently is like be able to put myself more out there with when the when the heat Can I tell you something? Nobody went broke doing 2x. Oh, no. Never. Right. Mhm. That's why I said 2x. A lot of people went broke trying to make 10x and I've seen it on my own. By going 2x, nothing wrong with that. Steady, steady. It ain't meant for all of us to be as rich as the richest. The richest, right? I mean, be where you're meant to be and and take that pace. Be happy and be rich. Everybody wants Oh, you know, like everybody's looking at like these, you know, people are like, "What's a million? Nothing." Like people have billions. Okay, dude. Not you weren't not everybody's meant to have a billion dollars. accept it and be thankful for what you are making, you know, and I'm very thankful. Look, I don't, you know, I work hard. I'm here 6 days a week, man. 70our weeks. Mad man. Mad man. But what am I going to do? You know, I'm sitting with you here right now. I'm having like chest pains. Where's that doctor that was here earlier? Cuz I'm tired, right? But what am I going to do? Right? You know, I got to keep plugging alg cuz I have kids. I have I have I have a whole family here of employees who count on me, right? for athletes who are still playing but thinking about life after sports, right? You're going to just start the the academy, right? That's probably what you should do. You really should. I should. I'll come with you, man. We'll start something nice. Give some good advice to them, you know. Um how should they, you know, start thinking what what is your advice to them? Um you know, should be how should they be preparing for business success while they're still in the game? Right. First thing, first thing I tell anybody is build a team. Um because you don't know everything and the biggest thing you don't have time to learn everything because you still got to keep the main thing the main thing and that's playing in the NBA and being able to perform on that court and that's your main job. So you you put a team together, you delegate the roles and let them go out there and and boost things and and bring you deals and then you sit down and you listen, figure out what you're interested in. Um, I always say start with something that's not going to take a lot of your time that you could put more time into learning and not actual being a part of. So once you learn that, like all business kind of work the same, like for the most part, you know what I'm saying? So once you learn the basics, everything else will flow. And then you just got to get comfortable within talking and being in pres presentations and just letting your team kind of take it take it for you and just showing up and still knowing what you're talking about. Like even though you have a team, you still got to know exactly what they're doing and know how they're doing it. Do friends make good business team members? It depends. And that's a tough one. Isn't that tough? Like I can do this for you. I can do that for you. Um,

sometimes. I guess the answer is sometimes. Sometimes. I'll say this, your selfless friends are the best ones to work with. Like my best friend, I've known him since 2 years old. My backcourt teammate in in high school, junior high, elementary school. Once we got to, he's a year older than me. Once we got to high school, he didn't really want to play basketball at the next level. And I knew I would. And he was like, "Bro, whatever you need from me," and he's telling me this at 17, "Whatever you need from me, I'm always gonna be there for you." And it's kind of like, "All right." Yeah, like we locked in. We brothers, but like at 39, we're still like that. And he still calls me to this day, "Hey, bro, I'm in stocks. I got this stock. I got your money here. I'm about to put it over here. Is that okay with you?" And it's like, "Yeah, you you're doing all my stocks. Like, you don't have to ask me permission." He's like, "Nah, this is your money, your stock. So, I'm going to ask you permission cuz that's what I have to do to be underneath you to make sure that you know what's going on. And that's important, right? Yeah. And I'm like, okay. So, you care about sometimes people think they don't have to ask anymore, right? So, somebody that cares about it more than you is always going to take care of it better for you. What advice do you have for me besides like pick, you know, going the fourth time into the hospital after picking up a basketball court? Um, first just think about like like the magnitude of the attention and people you've dealt with is you know hundred times bigger than what we deal with regular folks, right? So, and you're very balanced and I think of course sports has a lot to keeping you grounded, right? And I try I try to work out, you know, bike and raetball and stuff like that. Um, but what do you tell entrepreneurs like me who are always grinding and building and running fast cuz we have to like we we don't have we have to make decisions very quickly for other people, right? How do we keep saying man? What would you tell me? Like Alex, this is what you and you you you met me before we started recording when in a little bit of a more crazier situation because I'm a I'm a serial entrepreneur, you know, like a lot of people out there that are optimist believers, you know, we think we can pull it off. What would you tell me? I say the the biggest thing just find your outlet. Like you deal with a lot of a lot of stuff every day. People's personalities, people's ideas. You just deal with a lot of people every day and it's like you love it, you enjoy it, but at the same time it can get overwhelming and once you get overwhelmed, you just got to have that outlet and just once you get to that outlet like

Yeah, I think I'm going to go to like the Prada outlet after this. By the way, thank you so much, man. I really appreciate this. And you know if there's one thing and I'm I again I deal with so many entrepreneurs and business people and um if there's one thing that I got from the most important thing about I mean besides having a good team and besides you know going slow about the the most important decisions um it's it's how calm you are. First of all you're [ __ ] legend right? like you're a superstar. Superstar, right? But how you're humble and calm about it, right? And you know just that you just man it's it's awesome. It's just awesome. And so that's what you know the people listening that success doesn't mean loud or does it right? Success and enjoying success is just staying balanced and and staying real and stuff. Man, I really enjoyed this. Thank you so much for taking the time to stop by, man. Thank you.